RE: Soft for Dancers Up Date #2/ Articles On Line[was dance and language thread]

From: Richard Widgery (motion@widgery.demon.co.uk)
Date: 04/10/02


Re: Soft for Dancers Up Date #2/ Articles On Line[wasDear Armando & Antonio,

May I thank you for your narratives; this discussion is really getting
interesting, sorry I have not joined in before... partly I wished to see how
it would pan out before jumping in.  It is now getting very wide based,
multi threaded and wish to address a "few" issues.

I tend to find more agreement with Armando's replies in respect to "Movement
vs. Gesture", "Velocity Peeking", "Emotional Engagement", and "Psychological
Archetypes", but now wish to diverse into what I consider to be a more
fundamental principal of software development:  "What are you trying to
achieve?".

"Given enough resources - I can develop anything...." seems to be a common
drive of mankind.  I have just had the 'timing' fortune to see Spielberg's
(aka Kubrick's) A.I. feature film last night, which unintentionally (i.e.
not script writer intention) brought up some very serious questions about
commercial exploitation that they seemed to overlook... mainly WHY create a
sentient avatar - regardless of Hollywood happy ending stories.

I had a discussion with a well known Visual Effects company a few years back
when they asked me how long it would be until I could generate a fully
synthetic, visually unquestionable, representations of a human actor.  When
I asked why, they replied because the client did not want to pay background
extras (actors) royalty right every time they aired the commercials.  OK..
I'm not going to go off one a commercial exploits argument, but what I would
like to discuss is the INTENTIONS / APPLICATIONS of the types of software
you would like to use or create.

Everyone so far has put forward very good and constructive aspects of tools
development without ever saying HOW they want to use them (Armando / mjumbe
describe methods of implementation via scripting, but never describes the
application).

As a software developer, it is essential to know know why people are using a
tools as much as knowing how, and I would like to ask if you would ideally
like a computer to totally synthesis it's own dance choreography, or whether
you would like better tools for pre/visualise 3D animations of your own
performances, or whether they would like to have computer augment
visual/audio performances in Real/Non Real time...etc... What are the
fundamental OUTPUTs you are trying to achieve?

I agree that a library of "microdances" is 'almost' essential for any of the
above, but what interest me more as a MoCap expert is why you would go to
the trouble of recording 50 microdances, bolting them together (with some
emotional variables/blending factors) and generating a 3D representation of
a continuous dance segment of performance - rather than just capturing the
thing in the first place.  This comes back to the discussion about emotional
content, and I propose that a singular performer (human real person) will
give a more congruent, sensitive, comprehensive, and component compliant
performance with "tonal" harmony than a piece-meal compilation of
microdances.

If you disagree - I would ask WHY would you WANT a computer to produce a
congruent.........harmony performance all by itself.  Are you doing it
because it is there to be done? Or are you doing it for personal artistic
merits?  If you fall into the first category I would like to ask where you
think the boundaries of A.I. movement interaction should become a moral
debate (please do not reply that Art & Morals should not be discussed
together - unconstructive), and if you fall into the latter - could you
please be more specific about you "product" or "presentation" that you wish
to achieve.

I feel that what I have written my fallen short of expectations of
"artists", but I whish to get a better grasp of the OBJECTIVE and
QUALITATIVE expectations of digital choreographers.  For example I was
pleased to see Merce Cunningham's "Biped" presentation at the Barbican -
London last year - I was impressed with much of the graphical interpretation
of body movement to abstract illustration / graphic art, but disappointed
when a "raw video representation" of mocap markers came flooding across the
screen - for me this is like seeing the dust on the inside of a cathode ray
tube and someone stating "wow - look at the art in the fact we are using
optical motion capture markers (i.e. ping pong balls)" - sorry it a part of
the process I see every day, day in, day out, not piece of art just because
it has been put into a context of an auditorium (personal critique -
sorry).9

In terms of software, visualisation / presentation, tools development, what
OUTPUT / RESULT would you like to achieve - maybe debate this before
debating what process / language you would implement?

Food for thought,



Richard Widgery
richardw@kinetic-impulse.com
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KINETIC IMPULSE
Digital Performance Art & Science
http://www.kinetic-impulse.com
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